As an expert in human performance coaching and organizational leadership, Dr. Paulie Gavoni is a behavior scientist who has worked in Education Human Services and sports for over two decades in this capacity.
He served the needs of children adults in a variety positions including CEO vice president director Professor assistant principal manager lead therapist coach and behavior analyst Dr. Gavoni is passionate about applied ABA and organizational behavior management strategies to lead and help other leaders, established positive and engaging environments.
He has used his expertise with the Mixed Martial Arts Community where he was a formal champion and highly respected coach.
And he also presents it to a massive audience to numerous Publications such as a number one selling co-author and author as well as through radio and podcasts.
Our Educators have been immensely fortunate over the years to have been supported by APSEA AIE to participate in plcs and webinars with Dr. Gavoni for some of his books such as deliberate coaching and quick wins, and I am delighted to introduce him today.
We often known as Dr. Pauly around here a reminder to put any of your questions in the chat box and use the raise your hand icon during the presentation.
Thank you so much for that lovely introduction.
And I really do it's been such a positive experience of collaborating with you guys over the last couple years.
I wish everybody was so friendly and makes me want to move up there.
I told you I have I have Roots up there.
My my great grandmother was from Nova Scotia.
So I hopefully one day I'll get the chance to come up there and meet everybody in person.
But I'm really, you know thankful to be invited here today to talk about something.
I'm very very passionate about and that is the application of the science of human behavior in in education.
And you know, I know there's been a lot of talk about making, you know schools more compassionate bringing trauma informed care into schools.
Is that a thing up?
Is that going on up in your areas?
And you guys just type that in the chat real quick for me, you know, our schools are focusing on trauma informed care.
And so I am all listen.
I am very much supportive of being compassionate and very much supportive of Trauma-informed care I came out of a mental health background and social work.
But what I've learned is that for all of this stuff.
There's the issue comes down to if we want to if we want to create an environment that is a compassionate or trauma-informed.
We can't only look at the interactions between the say the teacher and the student or the parent and the student if we're gonna have a trauma informed environment if we're gonna if we're gonna We want our Educators to be compassionate with our students.
Well, then that needs to occur up the chain right I would argue that being trauma-informed should just be the way we do things that giving people helping people feel safe and powering them and giving them choice and you know collaborating.
I think that's the way it should be and I would say that being compassionate should just be something we do in a moment with a certain person.
I think we should all engage in all the behaviors that are associated with compassion still comes back to behavior and you know, one of the things that people struggle with and even, you know people in my field of apply Behavior Is by the way, how many can you type a yes in here?
If you guys can let me know where you guys what your role is, you know, are you behavior analyst are you a teacher guidance counselor?
Who do we have in here today?
nice mix a lot of behavior analysts good.
Oh, this is lovely wonderful because something in here for everybody.
So we have a wide variety of folks in here and I would say that whether we are whether you're aren't familiar with behavior analysis or even those who are who are board certified Behavior analysts in this group or behavior specialist.
There's this thing that occurs when when we start focusing removing our Focus From the student and looking at the adults in the building and I call this behavior on myopia because we forget that if we want to help that student perform.
Well, right, who do we have to bring out the best in right?
We're gonna bring out the best in the student.
Who do we need to bring out the best thing if you guys can type that in the chat for me real quick who must we bring out the best and if you want to bring out the best in the children in our schools, And you can't be wrong.
Yeah, the staff are selves good the caregivers 100% So they are all part of the environment and what are the hundred plus years of science tells us that if we're going to change Behavior.
We need to change the environment if we're going to create we're going to help students achieve and meet their goals.
Then we have to range the environment such a way where they can and we are all a part of that environment and if we don't think about the same compassionate approach, we don't think about the same trauma informed approach when working with the adults and the building.
Well that becomes a huge problem because people are walking around feeling unsafe feeling like they're not collaborative feeling that people don't like them or this is not the place that I want to be and that is not how we get the best performance out of people when people feel cared for and they feel safe and they feel that they're being provided the tools.
They need to be affected in the classroom.
This is how we bring out the best in our students and I would argue that at the root of compassion is this term that is very common to people but that there's a fundamental misunderstanding of what it is and will go now unpack that later on and that is positive reinforcement.
If we get people in touch with positive reinforcement and don't necessarily mean giving them praise, right which that can be a positive reinforcer.
I mean helping them get in touch with valued outcome for themselves.
And if you're the person that's doing that and we that you understand whoever you're supporting what their needs are.
And what their wants are we're engaging in behavior that or supporting them in those areas.
I think this is at the heart of compassion.
And so I want to take a look at that because we're gonna zoom out instead of just looking at again the student we need to think about the entire environment and what it takes to create this environment that's you know, Laden with heart and Sciences like what I like to call it everybody with me so far.
Does this make sense to everybody where I'm going with this one up we're gonna unpack the behaviors associated with a you know with the system what a system should look like for creating a compassionate environment and travel informed right great.
Thank you for the the affirmations there.
It's want to make sure Somebody could say well now I'm confused and that's okay, too.
But you know, whoever's in here today, do we have any administrators by the way because it would be awesome if we did any administrators in here if you can just you know, drop a yes in there.
Okay, good that that's awesome.
Right so because they're you know administrators are key.
This is so critically important but it you know, it really doesn't matter what somebody's title is.
You know because because in the end what everybody is responsible for is this thing right here, right?
We in the science of human behavior.
We keep it very simple right linking key behaviors to Value results.
And what are some valued results.
Do you think in education what's important in education?
Go ahead and just type in the chat if you can for me what we want to see what a valued outcomes.
Okay, CL Independence love that safety.
Trust love that happiness could quality of life feelings.
Yes critical thinking.
relationships Self advocacy.
My this is so different.
If I would ask this in the United States, I probably would have got a lot of grades student achievement.
I'd like what you guys are saying here better.
I think this is all more important, but I think if you create this kind of environment if you Produce this kind of result people students are going to achieve, you know in the end, you know that but this is fundamental to achievement.
So this is really good.
So let's unpack this a little bit.
Okay, let's but with this nice little visual that I created here.
And that is an education.
We really need to start with the end in mind.
Right we need to start with what are the students wants and needs right?
So what do they need in terms of skills and knowledge and those things right?
What kind of learning opportunities do we need to provide them?
And what are the wants meaning?
What are the reinforcers?
You know, so how can we help them to be successful in getting in touch with the things that are important to them?
This is extremely important, but we can't just think about them, right?
We also have to think about the wants and needs for the people up the chain.
What's the pairs in this example?
We could we I could keep zooming out.
I will at the end and go all the way up to District leadership and even the state right all these people are interconnected, right?
So what is the Parham wanting in other words?
What are the reinforcers and what kind of skills might they need to better support the student.
In the RBT if there's one of those in the classroom and the teacher and the specialist, all these behaviors are interlocking, right?
So we need to start with that end in mind and we have to think about what how we gonna measure this whether it be for a student or a classroom or a school or a district.
So if we're saying that we want compassion, how do we know that?
Well, how can we measure that people are behaving compassionally?
What are the outcomes?
We we say people are safer and you know, we're they're collaborating more and they feel empowered.
All right, maybe there's social validity surveys, but we need to have a way to know that we are actually producing these outcomes.
And so what role do you guys play in this?
Well, depending on where you're at, especially if you're in a district position you are in the role where your supporting the behaviors of people of the chain, right?
So again, if we're gonna bring out the best in the student, we got to bring in this example.
We got to bring out the Us in the pair if we're going to bring out the best in rvt, we've got to bring out the best and the teacher and so forth all the way up the chain and so the question is when we talk about compassion when we talk about this heart and science when we talk about trauma informed care in the schools, what are some key behaviors do you think people need to engage in right how would I know somebody was engaging in behaviors that helped somebody to feel safe and you guys go ahead and type it in here and you can't be wrong the only thing that would make it wrong is if it was in a behavior Behavior something that you can observe right you can see you can see me doing it I could see you doing it What are some behaviors that we want to see people doing?
I think I stumped like 219 people.
Okay, so okay listening.
I saw a few things go through here, right?
That's good helping engagement, right soft tone of voice.
That was very behavioral listening.
I could say was very behavioral asking questions body language.
Yes me scroll back up here.
Right if I were to say and this is not you know, if I were to say be respectful how would I know somebody was being respectful, you know, if you were to say I want you to be more respectful to you, you know, maybe that meant like involving you like giving you choices and things asking you questions acting on some of your suggestions speaking to you in you know, in a tone of voice that is kind all these kind of pieces nodding when I when when I'm listening to you, so we need to bring these down to behaviors and those behaviors need to be unpacked up the chain.
We can't just look at the student because This has especially when it comes to leadership leadership Behavior can have a ripple effect across the whole school and not can it does it can have a very very positive impact on the culture which is shared Behavior or it can have a very negative impact across the culture again, which is shared behavior.
And so we have to unpack this stuff.
So if we're talking about, you know, you know, even you know, being flexible or even validating feelings, I believe that is an important thing the validate feelings, but if we were going how would we know that somebody was actually doing it right?
Maybe it's making a statement of validation, you know saying like hey, I bet you feel upset about that.
I'm very sorry and I don't blame you for doing that.
Right and which is perfect.
We just make sure that we understand what behaviors that people need to engage in because it's still always comes back to behavior.
It's not enough to say let's have trauma informed care environment.
Let's be more compassionate.
It's that's a good start.
But what does that look like?
And what does it look like up the chain?
Because what the pair does in this example to help the student feel safe is going to be different than what the specialist does to help the teacher feel safe.
And that's probably going to be different than what the school leader does to help that specialist feel safe.
Does that make sense to everybody because that's in this is important concept to understand these interlocking behaviors or what we call Meta contingencies.
So our Behavior impacts the behavior of others and their behavior impacts our behaviors.
Makes sense everybody.
I got one.
I want to make sure if somebody doesn't it doesn't make sense.
Oh, I got absolutely make sense.
I love that.
Yes, it's all interlocking.
We if we we always keep the end in mind, right?
What is it that we want for the student or the students and like we then we have to think about.
We want that for the students.
What behaviors do we need to engage in?
There's a famous quote by and I can't remember the guys name.
Who's the guys the guy from Virgin Airlines?
It's like my favorite quote.
I can't even remember his name.
I've been hitting the head a lot.
Yeah, Richard Branson.
Yes, Richard Branson.
So Richard Branson says, it's not about the consumer.
I'm screwing his quote up.
I'm sure but it's not about the consumer or the client.
It's about the employees if you make it about the employees and they're gonna take care of the consumer of the client, right?
So we have to take care of the Educators in the building and we can't exclude them from all this trauma informed care and being empathetic and being compassionate.
We need to treat this way each other this way and this is how we're gonna help.
the students the best All right.
So now by the way we call this in the organizational behavior management realm we call this pinpointing and that as we have a specific result, we're trying to achieve and we have specific behaviors that we want people to engage in in order to achieve those results because all results require somebody doing something more less or differently.
Does that make sense those results won't occur unless people, you know engage in behavior.
And so and if they if we've chosen the right behaviors, we will get these outcomes that are associated with people feeling safe and empowered and collaborative and all those things which are associated with trauma informed care and compassion and all these pieces.
So now we need to look at this piece of it.
So if we know the results we're trying to achieve right we've identified these outcomes and we know the behaviors that people need to engage in up the line now we want to quantify things and quantifying things makes it easy for people to see that they're moving to in the right direction.
There's nothing better than feeling like you did your job at the end of the day has anybody ever walked away at the end of the day and wondered if you they did the things that they're supposed to do or then the week or the end of the month kind of yes, if you've ever had that feeling because I have had that feeling it's not a good feeling at all.
It's not a good feeling when you're not sure what you're supposed to be doing and if you're doing enough because there's a really good chance that you're doing more than you should say.
If you have that line that criteria and you were hitting in every day it will then maybe going above Beyond and if we know what that line is right with that goal is That puts people in a position to reinforce, right the student can look at those know their own goal and they're moving towards it in the the parent knows their goal every day and the things that they're supposed to accomplish along the way and I say accomplished because we can break down these goals into these metrics these smaller metrics of accomplishments.
So if we think about a goal, right, especially if it's an end goal, maybe you have a goal of you know, then end result right think about the end result as the end goal and you're gonna come down here and visit me and it's very pinpoint.
You're not just gonna come to Florida.
You're gonna come to my address, right?
So you have a specific result that you want to achieve coming to see me and you have a behavior that you're gonna engage in and maybe you're gonna drive down or you're gonna fly down.
So then you might set a goal that You're gonna do it by, you know, within a week, you know, let's say it was driving and then you're gonna set sub goals that maybe you want to drive, you know, a thousand or of 500 miles a day or 700 miles a day or hit a certain state line by the end of the day and then you might have accomplishments that you know, you want to get through, you know, 70 miles every hour or something along those lines in schools and larger schools.
If you only look at the results that result takes time to change because you must think about it.
Having helping people achieve their goals, right especially if they have to engage in Behavior change takes time.
The simplest example, I like to give is a school that's having a lot of behavior problems.
And as a result, they're having a lot of suspensions.
Do any of you guys work in schools with high rates suspensions up there type of yes, if you do if you've have schools where there's a lot of suspensions Yes High behaviors.
So let's say that we were going to we can just say hi great to behaviors.
Let's say we want to reduce high rates of behaviors across the school whether students are suspended or not.
Well what might need to happen, you know, I might go in there and do an assessment because we always want to find out why right we want to get to the real calls of why we're not achieving a good result why we're not getting the good behavior that we want and it's always gonna come down to the folks in the school.
Because as we mentioned earlier about results, right if we're going to change student Behavior whose Behavior do we have to change and you guys already said this earlier right the adults in the building up the chain and so what owes each one of these part professionals need to do that's going to produce this result and if they're not doing it why and there's only two reasons.
Can you guys type in maybe one reason you can think about That somebody wouldn't be engaging or performing to a standard.
I feel safe burn out.
Yeah home life.
I don't see value in it.
Yes, I'm gonna put yep.
Good, I'm gonna put this into two simple categories because we try to keep everything parsimonious in the science.
It's either a can't do or won't do and I'm gonna change that to don't do because won't sounds like it's refusing.
So essentially it's a skill deficit or performance deficit right or motivational deficit.
They don't have the skills to do it or they don't find Value in it.
It's not a reinforcer for them to do it and each one is a vastly different intervention.
If it's a skilled deficit then the the solution is to provide training which by the way a lot of trainings do not produce the outcomes we desire because they're not fluency based if you're going into any training or you're delivering training where you're not engaging in rehearsal with feedback and getting high repetition of it.
Well, most people are gonna walk back into the classroom or the school.
And they're gonna forget what they've been talked.
Even if they want to know it.
They're just gonna fall back in the old habits.
So we have to make sure that we provide them good training.
The other piece is that you know, they're not motivated.
Well, they're not gonna engage in the behavior.
And so what are some keys to motivating people?
Well, we really want to know what they value that's one way right find out what's important to them making sure that we're involving them in goal setting.
Can you imagine you people don't want to have other set goals for them?
They want to be involved in goal setting they want to know why it's important or see how it's a value to them.
We call this a stapling operation or people say, you know, what this is Meaningful enough for to for me to to work towards this reinforcer is better than I thought, you know, and it makes me want to engage in some Behavior change.
I can see the value in, you know, following a behavior plan or you know writing.
Classroom management plan.
So we're you know supporting the teacher with writing a classroom management plan because I want to help students achieve.
I want my job to be easier.
I don't want you know, the schools being stressed or parents being stressed.
There's a number of reinforcers that are tied into all the things that go on the schools and each person has different reinforces.
So understanding those and how they connect is critical remember when we started with what's the, you know, the needs and the wants of the student that is up the chain and some people might say well the professionals they might need to do it.
I wish it was that easy.
I wish we could just tell people you need to do it.
That's not the way it works though.
When you evolve people and you engage in leadership, you don't have to have the title The Leader to engage in leading or inspiring people when you when you help them by providing them the skills and you coach them by helping the support the transference of those skills and natural environment you start to establish yourself as a reinforce or a person of value and somebody that the folks are going to trust and want to follow and maybe they're gonna engage in behaviors that you guys have collaboratively decided or going to help them to produce value outcomes.
And I say this is getting to the heart of compassion and this is getting the heart of trauma or informed care, right?
So we want to set goals with people that small goals identify accomplishments and we're gonna be more likely to move and the right direction.
So here's a really critical piece to after we've set goals.
And that is we can't go around and if we've sent a smart goal in other words people value that goal.
It's very hard.
Especially if you're working at a district level position.
We're in a school, you know, but you're outside the classroom to go around see if everybody is meeting their goals, right?
Are they behaving towards their goals?
But people can take a look at their own goals their own performance, meaning the behaviors they're engaging in and the results they are producing and they can report up the chain.
I'm this becomes very important because this is how they can develop habits again if they've set a smart goal and that goes a meaningful to them and we can help people get into the habit of taking a look at their own behavior and Reporting out.
We really help to move performance in a positive direction a simple example of this is that I teach coaching to a lot of people and so an important strategy in coaching is question asking because questioning Ash asking helps people to become better observers over the behavior better observers of impact of their behavior on the environment and better observers of the impact of the environment on their behavior and it also helps people to not become prompt the pen and meaning they can better assess problem solve and make decisions even in your absence.
So this is critical so simple self-monitoring and Report out that I might have my coaches do is Count texting me at the end of the day about You know, how do they go today with asking questions and engaging question what they see happen as a result of the question.
What questions do they ask?
You know, what did the what did the their coachee say when they ask those questions?
What questions will they ask tomorrow?
What they start to see is that it becomes almost therapeutic for them and it becomes helpful for those their coaching and when that occurs that becomes a reinforcer for them and when they were doing it initially at the end of each day, then we fade into every other day.
Then we faded some once a week and pretty soon.
They had the coaching the question asking have it in their coaching repertoire.
So the self monitoring report out there's a lot of research that supports it and this is a really powerful way that after we provide people the skills.
To increase the likelihood that they are going to engage in those skills, right because there's a contingency but it's also reciprocal nature.
We just don't want to look one way.
We want to make sure that we have these reciprocal feedback loops in place here.
So people are telling you how they're performing if they're reaching their goals, right and you're asking good questions about it and you're giving them feedback on it now.
Hopefully this is lots of reinforcing feedback or you're asking them questions to help them better be a better Observer of their behavior and the impact of it so they can improve their performance in the future.
So this should set you up to positively enforce right?
So essentially somebody's reporting up to you the recruiting feedback you are providing them feedback and otherwise helping them get in touch with their goals, you know, their goals that are aligned with their wants and their needs coming back to this.
This is at what's at the heart of compassion if you're if you're giving them feedback in a way That helps them feel safe and you're giving in them to in a way that provides them feedback that helps them move in the right direction man.
This becomes very powerful.
And so we have a great question here.
What if the organizational culture does not encourage questioning and when that happens that's a great question.
This is a leadership issue.
I believe that good.
Leaders Foster question asking right they don't tell people what to do.
They engage people in this and how do you know that?
Well, I am a strong believer and as evidenced by what we have going on here of a reciprocal feedback.
Meaning feedback doesn't just go one way it goes up.
So we're not checking in with our people in terms of sociability measures think about surveys to see how they're feeling on a regular basis and acting upon that data man.
I don't think we are at all even close to engaging in some sort of culture that is compassionate or trauma informed or positive or one that's gonna bring out the best and the people because we need to know how people are feeling about things if they're not feeling good about things not feeling good about the leadership the coaching the support for being provided.
There's a good chance that they're just gonna do enough to get by and only when they're being looked at.
So yeah, absolutely.
That's Great comment, and I would say if that was happening in a school.
I would want to know what the district had in place in terms of these social validity surveys, right?
And I would honestly in some of the organizations I was at I wanted them weekly because I wanted to know how people especially if I was engaging in some sort of change management and I wanted to be able to be agile in my responding because sometimes people have a view on things but it's because and it might be the wrong View and it's not their faults because there was misinformation, you know, we weren't clear about something.
So we can clarify that rather than going months and months and people not understanding the why behind something we can make clarification.
and there's times that they have a good point and the system needs any adjusted and that they're giving us feedback and we're making those adjustments.
This is how we build trust.
This is how we build safety right?
Hey responding the people what their wants and needs are this is what's at the the heart of trauma reform care.
It's at what's at the heart of compassion.
Does that make sense?
Everybody as my little formative assessment here.
Would you agree with what I'm saying up to this point?
Yes, I feel very very passionate about this.
And by the way, if your leaders aren't engaging in this stuff, I would say I don't even blame them.
It's first of all leading an education is very challenging and you know, if they knew better and believe better, they would do better, you know, most people are not training the sides even Behavior or it's been misinterpreted for them, which is not their fault.
You know, our field has not done a great job of the seminating it and helping people to understand that this is what's at the heart of compassion positive reinforcement.
They think positive reinforcement is giving people Skittles and no it's helping people get in touch with that outcomes.
I'm not saying it's never about giving people Skittles, but that's the means to end the end is helping them get in touch with valued outcomes for themselves.
Very very important.
Yeah, no Dave a lot of times they don't get it.
And this is why this needs to go up this whole chart zooming out needs to go up right to school leadership District leadership State leadership, you know, everybody needs to understand these pieces of the puzzle and their involvement in it because when the students not successful, it means something is going on up here and we need to know how people are feeling about things and know that they have goals that's working towards and they're achieving their goals and we have to take a look at their behave if they're not why they might not be engaging that behavior again.
Is it a skilled up sit or will deficit this is all critical to success.
All right, so moving on here Oh, I did.
I actually just I went backwards and I I did talk about reciprocal feedback how it's got to be both ways rides my directional.
So now this is kind of what we were just saying there here Dave and that is um, you know, we have to think about how what are the values right that are in a school or District?
What's the vision the mission right?
The vision is like, you know the EO in the sky where we want to go the missions how we're going to get there.
The values are who and what's important is the way of being Paul.
She's a really important because you know, they set Behavior moving in a certain direction and they provide like boundaries for them to work within how are people being trained.
How are they being selected?
Are we selecting People based on values?
Are we selecting them based on skills for me?
I like to select people with a line values because I believe it's much easier to build skills than is to align values.
We have to have good planning and all these things serve as like these anecedents that Behavior going in the right direction.
So it all interacts with each other right beginning from the top but here's a piece that I want you guys to see and that is this is systems are made up of processes right processes are made up of procedures or tasks and tasks are made up of behavior.
And I put in this case trauma informed Behavior just as an example.
This could be any kind of behavior.
But if we're gonna have this kind of behavior, we would need to operationalize those.
What does it mean for the principle to help the school of feel safe and the AP The Faculty just to make the staff feel safe and so long to the student.
We have to boil it down to the behaviors and a good system increases the amount of positive reinforcement right for value added Behavior value at a behavior, meaning Behavior the ads to the end goal the measure right what's important to the school the district or in general the organization?
So how are we positively Forcing people and are we doing that?
And how do we know?
Well, they're engaging the right behavior and if we're positively reinforcing them in the right way, they would be reporting out how they feel now when I mentioned earlier about the reciprocal feedback.
I don't want to leave this out.
If we're using like a climate survey, let's say and we're doing it every month.
That kind of data should be used to even let's say it's bad data, right?
It's that school where questioning is punished.
Well, that's really bad thing.
I think that's a really good way to sync a culture right that does not help people feelings collaborative or empowered or safe or build trust.
That's at the upset end.
But I think that whoever that leader would be deserves to be coached, right?
We need to have a compassionate hand with them and determine is it a skill deficit or will that's it.
There's a probably a pretty good chance that it's a skilled deficit.
They're doing what they think is right because they're seeing maybe an outcome.
We're getting student achievement or when I put the whip down on people they engage in the behavior and we have to make it about the kids.
Well again, you can't make it about the kids without making it about the adults and the building but that that I can serve as a metric to set goals with that leader, right and then Set up a self monitoring report out reciprocal feedback process.
Another one is get that person in touch with reinforcement as they start to see that things are becoming better as a result of the change in their behavior because their behavior has a large ripple effect across this entire organization and we'll have a large ripple effect on whether this is a trauma informed school or a compassionate school or a positive culture or not really starts up here and trickles down right?
Does that make sense?
Everybody you guys with me?
You mean you just drop a yes in there if it does?
Or hell, yeah.
Thank you guys.
Yeah, good thumbs up.
Now let's we're gonna shift gears here and just a second.
Here we go.
There we go now.
Let's take a look at what positive reinforcement is.
We've heard this term a lot.
And I think this is a profound visual even for our folks who are behaviors because you know again, we've we kind of forget when it comes to adults that aren't behaving well enough and doing things that we need them to do.
We tend to engage in behaviors like blaming, you know, but if we're engaging in blaming behaviors, we've now taken off our Behavior lens because we know that in order to bring out the best in people we have to adjust the environment blaming is just the opposite of that it makes things worse, right?
We need to get people in touch with positive reinforcement.
But here's the way Behavior works.
Okay, so we've had an antecedents now usually we think about antecedence and ABCs when we're talking about bad behavior, what's the antecedent that comes right before this challenging Behavior bad behavior, you know, what is the consequence that's maintaining it but antecedents we can look at all when it comes to staff or what kind of training are people getting you know, what kind of goals do they have what was the planning looking like what about the assessments these are all the things that come before Behavior telling as well right telling people things that they need to do, but the problem is that it might get Behavior going but it's not enough to keep it going right anestheans are intended to get Behavior going, but it's about Meaningful consequence or these reinforcers to actually keep it moving in the right direction, right?
So no reinforcement, whether it's I get away from something.
I don't like or I get in touch with something I do like Then behavior is going to go away.
So for those of you that might feel frustrated if you've ever trained somebody how to do something maybe they went back into the classroom and tried to do it but it didn't produce an outcome right away for them.
And so the behavior went away our job for anybody outside the classroom would supporting those in the classroom is help to help them behave well enough and long enough where they start to see meaningful outcomes as a result of the behavior and that will take over for them as a reinforcement.
I'm going to show you what that looks like and just the minute now, unfortunately here is something that happens a lot not only in education most organizations and that is people engage or leaders, especially engage in the use of negative reinforcement as a means of getting people to do something right and so negative reinforcement and short is just a fear of consequences.
Um, think about why is it that you guys typically do the speed limit on the highway?
Why why are you doing speed limit on the highway?
Is because you love doing the speed limit.
What's that the root of your speed limit behavior?
All right, good.
All right to to stay safe, right?
So to avoid a ticket safety.
So usually avoiding something unless you're like in a beautiful area and you're taking in the sites, then you're probably doing the speed limit or maybe even going less because there's lots of positive reinforcement going on.
But in this case a lot of people drive to avoid right to escape danger and to escape getting a ticket, right?
Um, the problem with this is that the only time they tend to do better is when something is going on here.
What do you think is going on here when people tend to be performing a little bit better than they normally do.
What's what's going on these two high points here if you were driving and doing maybe you suddenly slowed down who would be looking right here.
Yeah performance reviews right in this case the cop right the accountability right the cops looking like Oh, no, I got us I got this speed limit now and you know, so you tend to perform better.
The problem is only temporary why because people are engaging the behavior because they just don't want to get in trouble.
So it's only long enough to get out of trouble.
Then it falls back to below.
And so this is why it's so important to get people in touch with positive reinforcers.
And this is so quite so important that we have things like preference assessments right these surveys or finding out what's important to people right their values is incredibly important.
So this is positive reinforcement R plus and all that means is something is added as a result of the behavior where the other one is something subtracted.
This means something is good.
Every time of behave it's like pumping water out behaving in water is coming out thirsty, you know, so I want more water so I keep pumping it.
So um, this is the only way we get people to go above and beyond or what we call discretionary effort.
And so we know that even if we have a good training a good good planning people tell you what to do or whatever, especially if it's a new Behavior.
It's gonna get Behavior going.
But remember we have to get behavior in touch with posery enforcement now initially, maybe that you supporting the student or might be you supporting a staff member or might be you being supported by somebody else, right?
Were performance so it's like a contrived reinforce.
So this is where you're doing a great job keep it up and obviously being behaviorally specific or this might be like giving the child the token or the Skittles or whatever.
We want them to engage in this behaviors long enough for well enough until they see that it's producing a naturally occurring positive reinforcer that teachers see this sees the students are behaving better that students are happier.
They're more engaged.
Their job just got a little bit, you know easier as well and the the leaders are coming in and giving them some good feedback or the student the accomplishes something that they were having a hard time accomplishing before right?
You've seen that look when they're so excited that they did it on their own and you shaped their performance, right?
So you tell give them a good feedback you give a contrived reinforcement and then they see that they produce this outcome again, and then again and then over time.
We get a habit right?
This is habit strength Behavior.
Now, I want to say that this is also why I spoke at this at the beginning and turns about wants and needs and values.
I say that positive reinforcers, right?
This is that what's at the root of our our values but what values are automatic reinforcers So let's I want to introduce you to the ACT Matrix here because I believe this is a really important tool for I believe it's like a preference assessment.
I believe it's a functional Behavior assessment a behavior and intervention plan.
It's really a self validity and as opposed to sociability.
It's like the perfect tool I think for helping people be a better Observer of the behavior the impact of their behavior on the environment and the impact of the environment on their behavior, but let's start with here.
I just talked about values, but what are values so we know again I they can just be considered simply like automatic reinforcers right that it's just the way of being and doing things like being kind or helpful or trustworthy your Ventures curious or patient.
You know what while we can accomplish value driven goals values our goals because they can never be accomplished right?
There is no end result or permanent product.
Like I'm not gonna say I have done being trustworthy for the day mission accomplished, right, you know values are more like our personal roadmap and they really help us to make choices based on the directions that we want our lives to go in an education, you know, we need to know what these values are, you know, but again, they're what we want to be who we want to be and when we when when our values connect we are just become better able to assess problem and make decisions take actions that move us towards them right move us towards these meaningful outcomes.
And that's extremely important this this list the list can go on on giving people choice collaborating kindness, right all you know empowering people it trust right?
Those are all things that are aligned with being compassionate and engaging in and Trauma informed care, right?
Those are all aligned with values, but we can also have this thing where we engage in behaviors that move us away from our values.
And a lot of times we aren't even aware of this.
So here's what happens right?
Here's our values down here the who and what's important to us the way of being and doing.
Well we in tend to have these things called up show up that are what we packed or label us thoughts and feelings and bodily Sensations, but sure these are covert behaviors or private events that only we can observe right now.
Here's the problem when we feel bad about something we tend to engage in behaviors that help us to feel better.
And that's not a problem all time.
Right if you feel better and it's not moving away from your values.
But what if we do things like we're frustrated and we yell at somebody right but we said, you know, what collaborating and having relationships and being kind are our values.
Well, we are not behaving right now in alignment with our values, right?
We are actually moving away from them makes sense.
These are precursors to this over unproductive Behavior.
So we feel this way.
We behave this way, right?
We have these covert behaviors.
We behave this way now is that behavior even though it's making you feel better is a moving you towards or away from your values.
Okay, if it's moving you away from your values, then what behaviors should we engage in?
And this is where the the difference between cognitive behavioral therapy.
And what we call acceptance commitment therapy or training kicks in and that is and there's a lot of good resources of support cognitive therapy is not a knock on that was came from the mental health field and use it a lot.
But this is the simple difference and because they both they both end up in the same place.
I feel that cognitive behavioral therapy just takes an extra step and that is cognitive behavioral therapist therapy requires you to change your thoughts in order to change your behaving that makes sense.
Let me think differently about it and I will do differently right acceptance commitment says, you know what?
Let me be aware of my thoughts.
Let me be aware of the alignment between my thoughts and unproductive Behavior the behaviors that move me away from my values, right and but instead of trying to change those because that's kind of like holding a ball under water and it's taking the focus on where it needs to be and that is what behaviors do I need to commit to right?
This is like you're from for our behavior analyst this is like your behavior intervention plan, right?
I have a functional Behavior assessment.
I understand that I engage these behaviors because it makes me feel better, you know, but I also understand that's not moving me towards my values or my automatic reinforcers.
So determining what these behaviors are becomes very critical because these are the behaviors that should move you towards your values and there's some pivotal ones that I talked about earlier like that pinpointing results and behavior goal setting self monitoring report out reciprocal feedback increasing the use of positive reinforcement and it can go on and on this is all contextual you can use this.
Your personal life you can use this in a classroom at a school.
It could be at a district level or state level where you're saying.
What are shared values what shows up for us as a group of people.
How would we know?
We're not moving towards those values.
What should we engage in this that?
And so this becomes this gets back to again.
What's at the horror of compassion and knowing what the the students wants and needs are in the Paris wants and needs an rbts and the teachers and the Specialists and the guidance counselor and the director and principal and assistant principle knowing all these and looking and honing into what are our shared values.
What are we all agree is important to us and then walking through this whole process and doing these checks.
Everyone's in a while.
Are we engaging behaviors that are online with that?
How do we know?
Well, are we producing those outcomes?
And are we producing those outcomes in the right way right in the ways that we value so with that I actually have Few minutes left they're going to open this up.
How was that for you guys today?
Did I make sense with the connection?
I wanted to just unpack behaviorally compassion trauma form saying that this all comes back.
To behavior and alignment with behavior was able to do that for you today.
Yeah, I believe I really do want people to be compassionate.
I just want them to understand how we get there and still is Gonna Come Back To behaviors and people's reinforcers right in the science of human behaviors not cold.
You know, this is the science of helping.
It's the science of trauma informed care.
It's the science behind compassion.
So, um, you know, I want to leave this open for any questions here Shelley if that's okay.
And also, please follow me on LinkedIn.
I'd love to be connected with people and or on Instagram Dr.
And if you have questions that you aren't able to put out here.
I'm very responsive.
You know, I happy to answer any questions and you know, I thank you so much for joining me for an hour of your life here.
Thank you so much Polly.
We really appreciate you sharing your work and your insights and your expertise.
I noticed that the the quote about the skill deficit versus the will deficit really resonated with folks.
Oh, can you give your Instagram name?
I just dropped it right there.
There we go.
I'm not on Instagram.
I did want to mention for folks who are collecting bacd continuing education credits that the two codes for this session.
I kind of just snuck in the first one at the beginning.
So I'll give it to you again our four seven seven two one and I'll put both of these in the chat in a second and one five nine five five.
So those are the two so I don't see any other questions Polly.
I don't see if you noticed any coming through there.
No, and you know, there's no bad questions, but I also know it's always weird to put questions out, you know in one of these things.
So again, I invite you guys the contact me connect me on LinkedIn drop me a message on there or Instagram or Facebook and I'll be sure to respond.
I have hundreds I have over a hundred articles.
I have a YouTube website.
It's all free, you know, I put a bunch of stuff out.
I love helping people.
It makes me feel wonderful and you know, so, you know, be sure to access and if you pick up a book I make like a quarter of the on these books.
I don't sell books because I make money off of them.
You know, I know it helps people.
So I do have a four or five books out there that are, you know could be helpful in education.
And I had mentioned to the group as well.
We're looking at some more deliberate coaching book study groups starting in January.
So there may be some additional folks joining us to work their way through that as well.
So we're really excited about that.
I again want to thank you for your time for your generosity.
You're always so generous and kind and supporting us with our work here around deliberate coaching and around all of the other, you know coaching and act and all of the initiatives that we're supporting folks to learn more about so thank you so much for that to all of the folks who joined us for the last two days.
Thank you for hanging in.
It's been a really valuable learning experience.
I hope you've enjoyed it and I hope that you found that it's been a good use of your time.
I know that you know, there's not a lot of extra time in schools and having substitute teacher time is really tricky these days so I certainly appreciate everyone's dedication to the last two days and to all of the sessions.
I will be sending out some more information to folks about the Upcoming professional learning opportunities that I mentioned way back this morning, which seems days ago now, so I'll send that out TV email, but I just also wanted to give everyone a heads up that you will be receiving a Survey Monkey feedback link from Kyle hat probably early next week, and that will give you a chance to give us some feedback on the sessions over the last two days and also to let us know if you'd like a certificate of participation for your your work in these sessions.
So thank you so much everyone.
We will have more information about PL opportunities coming up and look forward to seeing everyone next time.
Take care everybody again.